I have PurpleWiki integrated with MovableType on my blog and should have it ready for public release as a plugin in about a week or so. I think the difference between blog and wiki is the sense of linear narrative that the blog provides. Pairing this with the emergent understandings that come from a wiki makes a powerful tool -- ChrisDent 2003-06-02
There is an RSS button on the RecentChanges page of this wiki and the RSS feed will give you recent changes which is the Wiki equivalent. Works well. -- JoiIto 2003-05-18
In "Group Voice" RossMayfield has more to say about the difference between weblog and wiki. He charactarizes a weblog as having more of an individual voice whereas wiki is the voice. This seems less true when there is extensive and illuminating commentary as the result of a weblog entry. Nonetheless, such commentary is rather exceptional. Would it necessarily be a mark of failure, if a wiki appeared to be primarily an individual effort? -- -- 220.127.116.11 2003-06-03 07:32:09 JST
Not necessarily. It takes a long time for a public Wiki to start up, and even then it does really require one or a handful of dedicated people that keep the pages clean and in order. Especially after the first WikiVandal arrives. This tends to make most fledgling wikis look like their WikiMasters. --JanneJalkanen
Designer Butt, Janne, but WikiVandals gives too much status. Sounds like a band. The term is widespread, and probably warranted by the afflicted. I've read somewhere a comment about how it must be a 'tiny thrill' considering the openness of the platform. Your mutability comment above reminds me of my image of the SandDune quality of wikis. Solid, but drifting. Some are occasionally inhabited by SandFleas. Good luck turning on the editing, maybe outside the LockUp - ArsAlias AkaWiki ( WhatsThis AutoMatic '?' )
I think BillSeitz is "right on target" in a comment he makes on "Getting up to speed on wikis - Part I" by JimMcGee:
"I think the self-organizing/emergence idea is key, or at least a key differentiator vs blog engines."
For more about this concept, see SelfOrganizingSystems
JimMcGee follows with "Getting up to speed on wikis - Part II" to include a pointer to "Blogging, RSS, and Wikis - Presentations, Papers, and a Pathfinder" by JennyLevine on her blog, The Shifted Librarian.
I think that WikiLogs are really exciting. A WikiLog mixes the strict structure of a weblog into the freedom of a wiki. YpsilantiEyeball:PublicWikiWeblogs -- MarkDilley (p.s. what do you think about inviting people to try editing a page in the SandBox?
Good idea. So... please feel free to mess around in the SandBox... -- JoiIto
The first time I saw a blog, I looked for a place to respond to the entries, like a message board. So I think I mistook my first blog experience for a wiki. Why aren't there more of wikis out there?
I'm somewhat surprised Doc hasn't created one. Or has he? I should ask.
I'm working on GlobeAlive "The World Live Web" and am starting to think of ways to use wikis to allow users to interact with live experts/participants when they're not online. Many have already suggested every participant at GlobeAlive have a blog, but the wikiblog medium might be even more attractive, as it sure beats our current form of offline interaction. -- Allen Searls
Hi Allen! I seems to me that the Wiki culture and the blog culture are pretty different and I don't see too much overlap of the people yet. I think as both become more complex, there is a natural convergence. You should push your dad to try wikis more. GlobeAlive is a VERY cool idea. -- JoiIto
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=blog+wiki Results 1 - 10 of about 64,300 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=bliki+blog+wiki Results 1 - 10 of about 169 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=wikilog Results 1 - 10 of about 19,700
15 june 2003
Audiences overlap, interests overlap. People overlap? What kind of site are you running here?
... a little joke while Thinkering? A few years ago, what would have been the results for either 'blog' or 'wiki' - as much as the combo now? Each term was built by leaders, and there are seamless integrations at work not just of BlogAndWiki, but site/forum/blog/wiki/cart/etc ...
Perhaps someone observing the BlogWiki convergence more than weeks (like myself) might inform from where the advance is based? What is the motivation. Blog is discovering wiki is my impression, as part of the tech/communicate culture that motivates it, and the wiki stands as an older, overlooked item to add to it's arsenal of talented tech. In the blogs and wikis I've visited while exploring each technology, I've seen more bloggers headlining 'I've added a wiki to my ...' than vice versa. Actually, I can't think of a single wiki that blared 'We've added a blog to our ...'!
Is there a wiki where the index queried for volunteers to admin the wiki blog, or be the editor.
Wikis are built by communities, or individuals, that build other things than audiences as their primary goal, relative to blog motivations. Bloggers also are builders, but more self and audience oriented, and some of the audience is always looking for something new.
Like watching people overlap.
Hey Joi. Yeah, my dad's not a wikiblogger yet. He can't hide from it for long though. Interestingly enough, at the Emerging Tech Conference, wikiblogging was clearly the hotter topic. For example, the social software alliance BoF, probably the most intense two hours of the conference, turned itself into a big wiki BTW, thanks for digging GlobeAlive. =)-- Allen
Here's a little more discussion on the nature of weblogs and wikis at jill/txt's site. Her post mentions a real-world analogy we might think of for blogs: newspaper (columns). Also, weblogs tend to encourage SoapBoxing and Trolls and Flaming behaviors, whereas Wikis tend more towards behaviors like the WikiMaster, WikiGnome, WikiFairies, and WikiGremlins.
But the post by JillWalker doesn't mention any real world analog for Wikis. One might think of Wikis as something like a graffiti wall. That might explain why some people don't understand wikis or have a negative image of them like they would of graffiti. Perhaps a better and more easily acceptable analogy would be a whiteboard that a group is using to brainstorm an idea or work on a problem.
This page at Abbenormal has the most comprehensive list of tools combining features of weblogs and wikis (wikilogs). And I like the way AbbeNormal (whose wiki has an RSS feed and other blog features) and you (whose blog categories link to wiki pages) are starting to combine the two, but I think there is still a long way to go. --DougHolton
I'm not sure there is an offline equivalent to wikis. Graffiti isn't it, because of both the negative connotation and the lack of thoughtful content. Certainly "Frodo Lives!" in the New York subway isn't the same as Wikipedia? Even collaborative offline media are much more concerned with attribution and much friendlier to commenting, rather than editing. The closest thing I can think of is jazz, where one player lays down a melody and the rest improvise around it, but jazz is still linear. There's no way to undo what has gone before. Maybe it's the improvisation of live jazz, with the added luxury of an instantly available editing deck? -- KatherineDerbyshire
I agree, I don't think wikis should be equated to a graffiti wall, I just was wondering what might explain the image some people may have of wikis. I can't find the reference, but I remember reading about some person who left a Word document intentionally open on a public computer, and he saw some of the same good and bad behaviors you might see with a wiki. But I can see now another thing that is wrong with the graffiti analogy. People do not typically just stumble across a wiki page accidentally or pass by it like they would a wall of graffiti. There probably is a meaningful connection to your interests that led you to a wiki page, such as a google search, a link from a blog, or following a wiki you like (RecentChangeJunkie). So I do like your jazz analogy because members in a jazz session share a similar connection. You have your jazz masters and your WikiMasters. --DougHolton
For some reason, the comments section of my blog feels like a public place. Trolls seem to think it's ok to come and piss on my sidewalk. (Please excuse the language.) My wiki feels like a commons. In Japan, there is an old tradition called "satoyama". The community in the Shinto religion based tradition would adopt a small mountainside as theirs to maintain. They often started by putting a small shrine at the top of the river. The god protected the spring. (This god was aways a woman for some reason...) The god told people not to pee in the river or dirty the water. (This was good for the people downstream.) Anyway, everyone in the community participating in taking care of the forest, river and other small things that needed taking care of. -- JoiIto 2003-05-18
Interesting transposition from nature (the feminine form of the word) to SocialSoftware environments. I think it is a subject worth exploring more. Since I am an old grump, I suspect that many wiki vandals are youth who "hate the fucking world", yet are striving for some competency in it. Unfortunately, a hopefully transitory competency is to be vulgar, cynical, and damaging. If I can shock you, then I must be worth something. This attitude may have something to do with a lack of something useful to do and a lack of credit / recognition when something useful is done. -- 18.104.22.168 2003-06-01 21:31:59 JST
Thanks for the editing and the discussion, KatherineDerbyshire. I used to work with MarkGuzdial at Georgia Institute of Technology, so maybe that means I can be a WikiPadawan, or a WikiEwok at least. --DougHolton
Much better! Thanks Katherine! -- JoiIto
BobGoodwinJones has a thoughtful article on "Blogs and Wikis: Environments for Online Collaboration"
A lot of discussion has already been done
The ability of the Net to come up with things never ceases to amaze me. I have a blog, which has some elements which, after thinking about it, really would be better served as a wiki. So I thought -- can you have the two together? That thought was a couple of weeks ago -- now I am looking at just such a site!
-John Howard Oxley